DiScussion: Pete Doherty Newsnight

Hmmmmm..... and what about the music? Isn't that the most important thing? Don't get me wrong, I love the rock'n'roll world of myths and legends and I think there should be that element to rock music and unfortunetly we're not breeding rock stars like that anymore which is a shame but jesus, you can't fake it honey...you're either born with IT or you're not, and if you are, don't use it as a marketing tool. Shame on you...

i thought it was weird as hell. it seemed like the establishment were trying to recognise him as a talented poet/musician so that when (although i'd say 'if') he dies they don't look so daft featuring an obituary. also, it provided them with some nice footage that they can reel out of him talking about drugs/death/self-destruction.

i think pete is a genuinely nice guy who has been misguided and like any other person with a drug addiction i really feel for him.

the pete/libertines thing has been turned into a spectacle and this is abhorable. the nme (and the music industry generally?) and the stupid girls and boys that surround and worship him/them should feel responsible for pete's state of mind and his decline.

a band/rockstar is only as good/big as the hype surrounding them and it's clear that pete really has made it. but he is only human and he cannot be blamed for what has happened in terms of the media. of course he could say no to things and realise he is acting out a rock n roll pantomime but this is his REAL life. and what a terrible tragedy it is.

It baffles me that he given such coverage by programmes like Newsnight. The Libertines don't sell particularly huge amounts of records, and in 10 years time they will probably be forgotten. Nevertheless, if they are going to interview him, why not get him to talk about his behaviour - stealing from his best friend, not turning up for concerts, charging fans money to play in their houses to feed his habit - rather than the sycophancy that we got.

Just seen the interview and thought it was a very honest and moving portrait of a young, talented, good looking man who is slowly beginning to realise he is pissing his life away.
As Pete says in the interview "I know where the self destruct button is... but I don't intend to press it."
Let's hope not.
Now can we all leave him & The Libertines alone and let them sort it out? Please?

Hmm. Does James Endeacott, the A&R man at Rough Trade, who was/is responsible for breaking The Libertines, deserve to be singled out for personal attention here? Can it be argued that people around the Libs have actually benefitted from allowing Doherty's addiction to continue? And if an A&R man is the closest the industry gets to a 'line manager' for a band, shouldn't he bear some weight of expectation about the social welfare of his employees?

Endeacott scored a first radio play ever for the Libs (I think) on Radio 4's Today Programme, while being interviewed about something else. With hindsight it seems oddly consistent with Doherty ending up 3 years later on Newsnight - true rebellion maybe being the capture of the posh media. David Baddiell discussing Pete on R4 probably stretches their audience much further than an NME cover.

Has anyone ever seen The Day Today when they interviewed the rapper Fur-Q about how he killed several people onstage at every gig? Or "Blouse" about their song about Myra Hindley?
Thats kinda what this felt like watching.

And they are going to be remembered in ten years time, not for the music though, sadly. Its so annoying that theres been so much talk about them since day one, i just detatched myself from it straight away, I feel its made their music more enjoyable not reading about them every day.

Suttcliff - The Musical!

It was quite frankly embarassing. The bit where she goes "could you play it" was awful.

The Libertines have a few decent songs, but are really not anything worth taking notice of musically. Pete seems like a decent fella who obviously needs some help. That is all.

Everyone loves to hear about a fuck up, which is why Pete was on Newsnight. I agree with Placid_Casual - why didn't they get him to talk endlessly about his terrible behaviour: the fact that they pretended to be interested in his music was laughable. Hopefully he'll die soon and we can all get our denouement to this vile media-constructed fairytale.

The only way to protest that I can think of is to stop buying the NME, which is a vacuous, idiotic, childish, CYNICAL pile of shit. STOP READING IT!!!!!!

Couldn't hear a bloody word he was saying to be honest. Looked good though.

from the horses mouth...

Mr + Mr ruff trade decided to "..give them anything they want.."

and that's how it all began.

this guy is no longer famous for his music, hes famous for his habit. if he stops taking drugs he's killing his career.

Watched the interview. Didn't care. I'll continue to judge Doherty by the quality of his music and of his lyrics, and as yet, he has failed to produce anything above average that ought to, in my view, gain the attention for the music he participates in. Libertines. One of modern music's mystery successes.

it made me see him in a different light

i had this image of him being a total fucking waster... now i feel sorry for him
hope he clears himself up soon and gets well and back to making his music properly

What a horrid, horrid interview.

I've had enough of him, I'm actually past caring. I just hope he gets better but he's not going to. If we were doing 'Fantasy Funerals 2005' he would be right up there sadly.

nme: "inspirational"!

A songwriter of the calibre of Peter only comes around once every 10 years. Commercial success has yet to arrive despite heavy promotion. The Libertines represent only a fraction of his work, indeed a lot of the songs on the recent album have been ruined, adapted to fit his former managers idea of modern rock music. Like all great writers Peter borrows ideas and incorporates them in his work, this is not a weakness. I advise his critics to download the widely available material (rather than pay a spiv on ebay) and then decide for themselves. I avoided the Libertines' hype, I only bought 'up the bracket' after the band had split. Make up your own mind, there is much more to this man than the drug addict he is known as.

'Me Oh Myra' by Blouse is a million times better than anything The Libertines or Babyshambles have done.

From what I've heard / seen of Pete, I really don't think he'd be considered either a great performer, musician or song writer had he not won the public over as a 'bit of a character' - largely defined by his drug fuelled antics. I'm not sure how romanticising heavy drug use will help him but it is a catch 22- if fans stopped going to shows, results may be worse than if they continue to put money his way. I really don't like the 'oh but he's a rock star so it's ok, that's how it should be' type attitude. That's just stupid. And to stick him on Newsnight makes no real sense either, there are so many people with similar problems more deserving of the spotlight that may actually want help rather than publicity.

Aww hes quite cute inne

I dunno, half of me feels sorry for him and the other half of me thinks he brought it on himself with his adolescent behaviour. He's a useful case study for highlighting how daft people can get. In the words of Art Brut "Stay off the smack!" Pity Pete didn't have an older brother looking out for him.

As for The Libs, yeah they are pretty good lyrically (the music is a laugh but nothing at all special.) However, there a tons of great songwriters who don't get a look in for the same old reasons (fat, ugly, don't live in London, aren't on drug, have no mates, etc, etc) so don't give me this crap about "A songwriter of the calibre of Peter only comes around once every 10 years."

each to there own and all that jazz be it drugs,money or music we all differ in our tastes and how passionate we are in the way we throw our selves into them. I would much rather have seen someone like Tom Mcrae though. Someone who lets the music speak and not the press machine hes got chugging along behind him.

pete has brought it all upon himself. true he is a genius, but he's fukin himself up. being a songwriting rockstar wannabe/self destructive person myself, i know what he's going through in a way. it's all down to the smack and crack, he just needs to STOP doing those drugs, they've got him by the balls bigtime. i've taken every other known substance to man, and tey all can get to you in the end. the media etc. also are playing a major part but they always would, it's part of being a rockstar.

i dont know why he just doesn't get a bong out, score some proper skunk and lie back and write a corker of a 3rd album for the libertines. i know it's a lot harder than than, but is it really? ive found that cannabis is a lot safer, productive, more fun than being addicted to smack.

the interview on newsnight to me showed exactly whats goin on in his mind. at the start of the interview the woman asking the questions was being nice to pete and humouring him, up to a point then she whacked him with a lot of questions about him destrying himself and he responded feeling very sorry for himself and became instantly fidgety, plucking his strings in defence. she humoured him up to a point and even got him to play a song, christs sakes. what was he doing on newnight anyway. it was sad.

BY THE WAY THERE IS A NEW BAND ON THE HORIZON, ONE THAT ONLY COMES AROUND ONCE IN A LIFETEIME, WATCH OUT FOR EM. THEYRE SHIT HOT HONESTLY. WONT NAME EM YET, JUST WATCH OUT. P.S. THEY'RE WELSH, THERES A CLUE. SHOULD BE GIGGING LIVERPOOL IN A FEW MONTHS.

theres a great article about the libertines in this weeks time out (the one with the beautiful scralett Johansson on the front)

check it out

I met him once when they were still playing toilets (I was working in said toilet). He was an arrogant prick even then. Put me off the band for life, apart from the fact they are purely average. Carl was a nice chap though.

Thats because he knew as all greats know that he was better then that toilet and you, pete is a legend as for the music being side stepped, the start of this interview does discuss what a great poet he was at an early age. Fuck all of you he have slagged him.

that post is so maddening from brodieman that i actually fucking registered and decided to post when usually i simply cant be arsed.

where to start? its people like you, you fucking cocknose that lead to all the trouble. telling people like pete who are flavour of the month that they are some kind of troubled genius, which leads them to disappear up their own arseholes and do things like simply not show up to gigs witout any reason whatsoever instead of just appreciating some VERY average pop music. Ditto Nirvana. You cunt.

hopefully he'll die soon? fuck you, you cynical cunt.

thing is, personally I love the Libertines, I think Pete is a gifted and amazingly talented songwriter, yeh he might be a fuck-up, a drug addict and yeh, that probably is very-poor judgement on his part but that doesn't take anything away from the music or who he is / he came across as a very troubled young man in the interview, perhaps it is his arrogant fault and yeh, not turning up for gigs and putting on fucked up shows when fans have paid to see you, yeh that aint on / but well his fate is in his own hands now, and just as much as those who cocksuck NME and make Pete out to be this troubled genius legend, all of you people calling him an arsehole and a talentless cunt are just as misguided and daft as well

if you disagree now, you aint likely to be convinced, if you don't see how great they are/were, then you'll never get it, no matter how much I try to explain to you - its just different ways people think

the Libs, Pete and Carl - just so fucking intense, a smack in the face and just so cool - the spirit in the libertines music and general aura - its something you either feel or you don't


*oh yeh, the welsh band some bloke mentioned earlier were shit hot / which part of Wales?, if the South Wales area then I can give a handful of pretty good guesses I think *

i think its sad for so many reasons. firstly i came across the libertines because of pete dougherty and not their music, which i found fucking irritating if im honest. second i think its shite the way everyone is like " oh poor pete" blah blah blah , im not being funny but courtney love was in the same position and she was called a dirty fucking junkie and the worst mother in the world.... dont quite see how its different to be fair. also the more ppl are like this towards him ( including the huge media interest), the more i feel that he will have no other option than take the kc way out because that is how everyone says the story will end, so thats how he will end it.
what angers me is how fucking stupid he is being by romanticising the whole aspect of his addiction. does he not think of the young teenagers who worship him and may think it a good idea to start smoking crack etc???

I really like the Libertines, and it's a shame that a decent band has been ruined because of one selfish individual who is worshipped by the NME either because of or despite his drug addiction. Pete needs to sort himself out and blaming Carl and everyone else around him isn't going to get him anywhere - it just makes him look pathetic and bitter.

I also wish NME would stop featuring bands who are mates with Pete even though they're crap!

All I can say is that Pete has never once used the media or his status to encourage people to take drugs. He said so himself that his fans are more intelligent than to want to use drugs just because he does. And ok, so you don't like his music. Fair enough, although I think slating him for his drug abuse all the time is out of order. Have you ever known a drug addict? Do you know how fucking hard it is to quit, once you've started? My brother was in almost the exact state Pete's in, and he died because of it. He was only 23. Once it's taken hold of you, it's the hardest thing in the world to try to overcome it.
If you listen to some of the lyrics Pete's written, they're actually quite profound and meaningful. Besides, if you're going to bitch about how crap his music is, then why don't you actually go and see if you can do better? Actions speak louder than words, after all.

Horrible band.

That is all.

Well I saw the interview and I thought he looked and sounded like a cool dude, very much in the same vein as the Stone Roses in their early interviews, i.e. not saying much, air of mystique about him.......... he was intelligent and stoned in the same breath (he'd been smokin serious amounts of rock just look at the colour of his fingers) and thats why people love him, they cant work him out, is he a genius or a fuck up? Is he arrogent or shy? ..........

The Libertines are a good band, they have decent songs and a decent image, on top of that you've got a guy who is a drug addict and a poet, two contradictions but both creative fuels in their own right. Also, you've got a guy who personifies rock n roll with his antics on stage, jumping into the crowd, not turning up to gigs, stealing from his best mate, it all adds to the interest......... BUT THIS DOES NOT MAKE HIM A LEGEND!!!!! To get to legendary status Pete Doherty will have to either die, write one of the best album's in history, or be a prolific force in music over the coming decades. He is not a legend just cos he's got a few good songs under his belt, a few tatoo's on his arm and a cool jacket hanging from his wardrobe.

I respect him for playing small gigs and not always searching for the spondolees, I also respect him for his 'dont give a shit attitude' to the press, though if he thinks starting fights or being rude to people is a way to solve his problems then my respect dwindles as he should use his brain instead, apparently he is a bright lad well lets see it.... Still I really hope he does the business in 2005 he is the most inspirational artist of late along with the Kasabian lads.

Finally, one last point: people in this forum shouldnt say they wish him dead thats just a fucking horrible thing to say, and they shouldnt say he or the Libertines are/were shit as he/they obviously arent!!! I think he's just troubled by an addiction and to immature at the moment to face up to it, he'll get a wake up call soon and start sorting it out, I hope.....

Peace

OH GOD
I JUST WROTE A WHOLE THING ABOUT HOW I HATE ALL THIS DISECTING OF PEOPLE..........BUT ........ANYWAY
I'LL TRY TO REMEMBER
YEAH YOU....STOP PICKING AT PEOPLE AND ACCEPT THEM AS THEY ACCEPT YOU.........PETE DOWHATEVERHISNAMEIS IS JUST A FELLA.......NOT LIKE Y'ALL OR WE WOULDN'T BE HERE DISCUSSING HIM.
I'M SURE I SHOULD HAVE SOME THING BETTER TO DO WITH MY TIME........BUT NO...I AM THE DEFENDER OF THE LITTLE ANGELS.......
WHEN AN ARTIST PUTS THEMSELVES OUT THERE.....ITS NOT FOR YOU OR ME...US.....TO TRY TO DESTROY ALL THE BEAUTY THAT IS BEING CREATED BY THE SACRIFICE OF KNOWING BETTER.
YOU ALL HAVE NINE TO FIVE JOBS I PRESUME AND ON THE WAY HOME CAN'T WAIT TO GET YOUR SLAVISH LITTLE HANDS ON THE MUSIC MAGS LINED UP FOR YOU TO SPEND YOUR SLAVE TOKENS ON.......WITHIN ARE PAGES OF YOUR FAVOURITE ARTISTS WHO YOU THEN PROCEED TO DISECT LIMB FROM LIMB .....TINY ARTERY
FROM TINY ARTERY..........UNTILL THERES NOTHING LEFT OF THESE PEOPLE.....AND USUALLY.........GOD FORBID IN THIS YOUNG MANS LIFE........A SUICIDE.
THEN YOU CAN ALL MOURN THE DEATH OF YOUR NOW FAVOURITE ARTIST.......AND FEEL SORRY FOR YOURSELVES THAT YOU NO LONGER HAVE AN ICON OF FREEDOM TO YOUR MUNDANE EXISTENCE.........GOD HELP YOU ALL...........TRY TO GET A LIFE. KNINE...KENAE.....WHATS THEIR NAME.......THE ONES THAT DO THE SAME THING EVERY GIG?SOMEWHERE ONLY WE KNOW PEOPLE.......NICE SONGS.......BUT THIS PETE GUY..........GOES A BIT DEEPER...TO SOMEWHERE ONLY WE KNOW........AND THE REST OF YOU CAN JUST FUK OFF FOREVER!!!!!!!!!!
LOVE AND A PIECE OF MY MIND
RUBY